Jesus travel to Ethiopia according to Coptic
Posted: Monday, December 17, 2001
( Ras Mandingo )
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There's a very good book called "Jesus lived in India" wich can illustrate this topic. Also "the murder of Christ" is wonderful.
So interesting to see Jesus as an articulated disciple, who chose himself, to show how much we could do ourselves!
it's really degenerative this idea of Jesus as someone who could do our work for ourselves!
As Cheik Anta Diop said in Civilization or Barbarism " Crist is a title for someone who watch over the misteries".
Thanks for the cultural and educational vibes!
RAs Mandingo, posting from Brasil.
( Ingrid )
That is an interesting book, which I read a while back but it is important to remember that Christ or KRST is the title of a person at a particular stage of development and throughout African history there were many. That is the reason the descriptions vary from region to region. But at least from all evidence they were black.
( RootsWomb(man) )
The title "Christ" (anointed one) has its ROOTS from the word KRST, also seen in the word "Krishna" in its masculine form, "Kali" in its feminine form, both meaning and being BLACK.
"The earliest gods and messiahs on all the continents were black. Research has yielded an impressive amount of material on the subject...The Messiahs, some of whom lived many centuries before Christ, had lives which so closely paralleled that of Christ that it seems most likely that the story of the latter was adapted from them. Moreover, the word Christ comes from the Indian, Krishna or Chrisna, which means "The Black One." J.A. Rogers
( Akinkawon )
Generally most of J.A. Rogers work could be easily proven today and I maintain a healthy respect for his insights, however, I believe that the Greeks and Romans got their concept of a Christ from the Egyptians hence they got closer to the ancient meaning - the anointed one.
Given the fact that persons in training for higher enlightenment used to travel to distant lands to learn about our diversity, the Indians knew the concept of Christhood before the Greeks and Romans. They would have coined the meaning Ďthe Black oneí from the appearance of the enlightened one. They may not have known what the Egyptians then later the Coptic meant by a KRST which is pronounced Christ before and after the use of vowels.
The Jews learned of this divine state from the Egyptians and they have been trying since then to make an anointed one for themselves. They do not know how that state is attained.
Egypt was the dominant power in the World at one time and people from all lands traveled to Egypt to get enlightened or at least sit at the feet of high priests.
A point of importance is that the enlightened ones of Egypt came from many different regions in Africa all the way to the Bantu people. The Egyptians were very fond of learning from the other African peoples with whom they traded and they held the elders in Nubia and Ethiopia in high regard.
I am drifting from the topic to make an important point often missed in the best of African history. All past and present enlightened Africans learned from all the peoples they encountered and they held the elders in the remotest parts of Africa in high regard.
Also there are many different African names for that same state of Christhood that is well depicted in the symbols of more indigenous Africans.
Even in the Christian concept of a Christ they show him traveling to many regions to learn. This was not only an Egyptian practice but was a practice developed in more Ancient African culture.
So as Ingrid alluded, a KRST is not one physical person for all eternity. Many different people have embodied the essence of life and have been able to assist in the evolution of humanity. KRST is the highest stage of human development. However what is depicted in the Christian concept of a Christ is not of the highest realization but more of a compilation of the characteristics of more indigenous anointed ones. There are many parts of their depiction that rings true but there are other parts that clearly show they did not grasp the essence of that stage of development. (QUITE UNDEDRSTANDABLE)
Looking for a Christ is a big deal today only because most people are lost but this was a natural developmental process for all people before people entered a new phase of corruption that started when Europeans migrated/invaded Africa, a land they had lost contact with and did not regard and remember was their former homeland.
I feel sorry for those who are in search of a White saviour because historically no one has stood out but the African saviours are many and legendary. That would make another interesting discussion. The idea that people could stay ignorant and simply claim to believe and that equals salvation or enlightenment is the most disrespectful thing they can do today. It means the very myths they hold they donít understand. As even in the Christian book it shows how a saviour is a learned person who does not allow racial prejudice to block him from learning.
These are the good examples they could draw from their Ďbiblesí but no, today if you tell some Black Christians (that includes Rasta Christians) to examine the culture closest to them, they are more afraid than Whites. There can be no worst form of slavery than that.
( RootsWomb(man) )
YES! You are absolutely correct! The KRST pre-dates KRISHNA, as Kush/Khemet is India's MOTHER...but I LOOOOOVED when you said this:
"These are the good examples they could draw from their Ďbiblesí but no, today if you tell some Black Christians (that includes Rasta Christians) to examine the culture closest to them, they are more afraid than Whites. There can be no worst form of slavery than that."
AFRIKANS - ARIZE!
( livelyup )
I give thanks for the powerful reasoning.
I&I believe that there is an important relationship that has been alluded to here but not spoken of explicitly, that is the the need for a context out of which an elightened one (KRST, christ, buddha, sadhu, sage...) may emerge. It is probably not enough for any individual to simply wish to become wise. For this wish to become reality requires that they are able to exist in a community that values wisdom, as opposed to the rote repition of 'truth', and that has developed a respect for the methods of attaining that wisdom. This, of necessity, is synonymous with a repect for the importance of the individual reaching understanding by their own power, rather than this understanding being handed down via an institutionalised source.
This may be the reason for the large number of african sages that have achieved historical prominance. In the african communities there seems to have existed communities that treasured wisdom, activley researched and applied the means to its attainment, and who celebrated and protected the wise.
In my own ancestral lands of Europe this was not the case since the coming of the romans. With them came institutionalised truth, which served their broader aims of a total dominance of all forms of defining what was legitimate. They activley sought to completely destroy all traces of the existing wisdom culture in its druidic form sending their death squads to explicitly exterminate these forms of social practices. Any subsequent efforts on the part of european people to re-connect with traditions of wisdom were met with persecution, torture, and death. This institutionalised legitimacy became part and parcel of european culture, and was a significant part of the genocide that we wrought on the indiginous inhabitants of the lands that we subsequently subjegated. We became the new romans. On an individual level for the average european this situation that has only very recently been, to some extent, reversed, with the renewed interest in wisdom traditions that has taken place since the 1930's and a corresponding lessening in the institutional capacity to suppress this trend. While the wait continues for a visible manifestation and personification of this new appreciation of wisdom amongst those of european cultural origins, ini would suggest that appropriate icons and exemplars may be found in the myths and belief systems that existed before the influence of the roman conquerers. Scratch an old celtic god/goddess, hero / heroine deep enough and you may just find the faintest traces of the 'white krst' that currently proves so ellusive.
Far more insidious has been the position of women with respect to participation in the search for enlightenment. Even within cultures that have been tolerant and supportive of those who seek wisdom, i&i believe that it is true to say that women have not been able to participate with equal freedom and power. Once again, perhaps it is in the more symbolic forms of myth and legend that we see personifications of the female krst principle.
Ini believe that the rasta collective need to be aware of this. Perhaps it is important for us to reason on how we may best create a community that best supports and transmits wisdom, and that activley pursues and develops the ways of wisdom, for all people who have the desire to travel this road.
Much respect and love,
( Akinkawon )
Interesting point, but a wise one Ďa KRSTí does not have a fragile ego that needs massaging. A KRST comes with the wisdom for the times we live in and the time we live in is antagonistic to the truth and higher principles so a real enlightened one would know how to navigate these times. It is not as if an enlightened one could be ignorant of the present environment.
Those that are in search of higher heights would value the truth for what it is whether it comes through a Man or Woman. It is the arrogance of males that has opened the way for females to become Women. As most females had to rely on their wits and other senses to survive the arrogance of male superiority, many are more developed today to reason on higher levels. The principle of Christhood is gender neutral, therefore any one (male or female, Black or White can attain it) the key is in knowing the processes for developing that essence in your self. This can be discussed some time in the near future.
But for the purposes of this discussion, it does not matter if many or few people can detect the KRST as those that were/are on the path of resisting mental slavery would see the KRST first as a aid or teacher then in themselves.
The KRST has different levels of meaning.
First it relates to those who have attained that union with the universal essence therefore can reason from a Universal understanding, then as a principle.
Another point is the reason at a particular time different cultures see the KRST with different features is because it usually is more that one person.
One person attains this union, and then the lessons are passed to others who were seeking (disciples). This brings about many such enlightened persons who disperse to areas where enlightenment is needed. So in China they may depict an anointed one with different features around the same time others are being portrayed differently in other parts of the world.
It is about a body of ideas that are realized through a discipline.
To become the embodiment of higher divine essence those seeking must first develop their principle of Manhood and Womanhood (this is different from maleness and femaleness). These principles are what give birth to the neutral essence (kundalini), commonly called the Son of God.
There are female names for Women who have attained this balance of Christhood. We can always develop this further as I have seen RootsWomb(man) referred to a few.
The people who are aware of these forces always hold the principles in high regard and they hold their teachers in the highest esteem. This is present today. It is just that too few people are sufficiently aware of the rudiments of history to be mentally liberated.
That is what they mean by many are called but few a chosen. The words of truth go out to the multitude but few people are willing to overcome laziness to do their own investigation to realize the truths for themselves.
Today many are called but so few have done the preparatory work of informing themselves so they are unprepared to reason on any level above their emotions.
Many Whites are trying but they are yet to overcome their superiority complexes and to some extent arrogance when attempting to reason with the past and to a large extent Africans.
( livelyup )
Thank you for the clarifications and reasoning. Seen. The importance of community that I was reffering to was not for the benifit of those that have achieved mastery. As you have quite rightly pointed out, the sage has little need for the approval of others, being as they are aware of the futility of such distinctions as approval and disapproval. Rather i considered it to be of importance to those (such as myself) who are beginning on the way. The sort of disciple/master relationship that you referred to is an example of what I had in mind, though I also had in mind some of the more practical elements of life. This concern stems from a growing unease about the fundamental incompatibility of modern forms of life and the attainment of any form of wisdom. I&i am wishing to reason further on this, the relationship of wisdom to both the culture that surrounds (and hopefully supports) it, and the meditations, methods, tools, and techniques used for the perfection and development of understanding.
Respect and love
( Akinkawon )
You have a good understanding as you interpreted the points quite well.
The point about finding a master is really something that you discover for yourself by you posing the questions and examining the responses you get. If you have the ability to grasp higher heights soon you would find yourself relating to several persons on a different level without any one telling you they are part of any particular group or school.
Discovering a Master is part of your own personal journey. I know my master and even if I introduce you to the individual, who has assisted many other individuals who in turn assist others, you still may not recognize them based on your needs.
Also, to ensure you do not waste your time in your search you should put on the table the deep questions you have and examine the different answers you get.
Finding masters is a major part of self-discovery as no one can do it on their own. But it is really up to you to recognize the master first through your own diligence and perseverance. Trust yourself!
( Ras Mandingo )
Someone told me that: "when the disciple is ready, the master will appear". Good topic that you point. One has to be honest and listen to the own conscience , that is always judging, comforting or praising us. In the old times, God was the voice of one's conscience. It's funny because in portugues, conscience means "with science. when I can realize what is wrong, I'm closer to re-vealing what is right.
There's a youniversal/universal truth that can be feel and experinced directly. And so, one will start to meet people that are also looking for answers, and will be able to compare, to inpire, to get inspiration... It's getting self-conscious that you are on a way. But to where? heaven or hell? How we die is how we live.
THE GOSPEL OF THOMAS
Jesus said: "Whoever finds the interpretation of this sayings will not taste death. Let one who seeks not stop seeking until one finds. When one finds, one will be disturbed. When one is disturbed, one will be amazed, and will reign over all."
( E.A.Sisi Tafari )
BLESSED BE THE HOLA ANNOINTED,HAILE SELLASSIE 1
Perfect trend;I give thanks.
To the brother from europe, pursue whatever is your righteous dream and help will come your way.
( IanI )
Ah! Greetings, Greetings!
Paul and Akinkawon!
What a refreshment for me morning to see the two reasoning here this day. And reaching overstandings and seeing the points made, how I must admit that brings I a wonderful sense of joy and a warmth. Seen.
Years ago, when I did first climb the hills to reason with James, quite a few white ones came to meet him, but me notice them brought with them pre-concieved attitudes and ideas of "enlightenment" from other religions or books or churches or temples. And all they saw when they saw James was, because of all that mind-conditioning and in-doctrination, was a 'dirty, scraggly, little, black man' that them could not relate to. A very, very few stayed and realized His Wisdom and accepted Him as their teacher and guide. But to most, Africa, Rastafari, Blackness, Natural Livity... all held undertones of the 'un-civilized'... the 'savages'. I think that for them this was sub-conscious, but isn't that what 'self knowledge' and 'enlightenment' is all about? Getting to know ones own self...consciously as well as sub-consciously?
I never felt any kind of ill feelings towards these people, just that I felt that maybe them would be on a very long, long journey since them did not seem to have a very good grasp on what them was really lookin for.
Guidance and Protection
( Jenny )
That is quite true for even African people. A very intelligent friend introduced me to a man whom he said was a teacher of the way and I traveled all the way to another country to meet him. The man did not look like an intelligent person so I wrestled with the idea about what is the look of intelligence. I could remember struggling with the feeling of disappointment. It is funny, but I want to go back because I missed out on an opportunity. Ingrid supposed to know who I talking about.
Many people are unaware of how media and certain images in books have altered our perceptions. I had this image of how Sai Baba looks and moves so I expected someone like him. But this man was very ordinary looking and he didnít do anything spectacular at first glance. When I got home I had these strong feelings and I still wish to go back. You are correct and it affects even African people who donít know ordinariness. Simplicity, thatís it.
( IanI )
Oh so true. In Jamaica is where IanI Rastafari get so much condemnation and rejection and scorn! And yet a white preacher man will come talkin about a white savior god and the people literally fall at his feet!! Pre-con-cieved brainwashment of the masses that can be that obvious, or as sub-conscious as I did speak of earlier.
The Realization for IanI is that the Naturalness of Creation is the Beauty of the Manifestation and that is the Simplicity the I speaks of. As far as 'going back', sistren, well may I suggest that the I forward when the opportunity presents itself once again and then perhaps the I will be in the mental and spiritual place where all that is being offered will be available unto the I. Seen. Give thanks.
Ites to the Most High.
Guidance and Protection
( livelyup )
Greetings and thanks to all!
First may i&i thank Akinkawon and all of the others who have patiently taken the time to reason and respond to the questions that i&i asked. This board is a special place that produces a truly wonderous array of thought and vision. I&i am lucky indeed to have stumbled upon it, it is not at all what i expected.....
Which brings me to this. IanI, once again you have demonstrated your uncanny gift at seeing straight into my mind and past the pretense that it is so often guarded with. Indeed, i&i have struggled to accept this rasta way. I have compared it overmuch with that which i was familiar, the zen, the tao, and the other asian schools. I cannot count how many times i&i have said in my mind, "they are really just like......". But you aren't, are you? Rasta is itself, and while it may be true that this livity aims to the same place as others, that is not the same as it being an identical thing. And so i&i have struggled on, thinking, thinking, too much thinking, when it is surrender that i&i must be practising instead. I have been a poor student of history. The truth never comes in the form that you expect it to (is this the first trial on the quest?). All of the great teachers have come from unexpected places, which in itself is a teaching about the idiocy of expectation....
So, Akinkawon, i&i will practice accptance and surrender, and will meditate, and hopefully one day will have a question of some worth to ask of those that write on this board. I will attempt to reveal my deep questions. But there is work to be done first. Thank you, and all, again for your help along the way.
Respect and love
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